Changing perspectives can truly unearth your potential

Organizations tend to see things from the “inside out”.

But the key is to see things from the “outside-in”. But just seeing things differently isn’t enough.

Which is why we have developed immersive leadership experiences.

Getting out of your bubble matters.

TIE helps create the leaders the world truly needs now.

Here I talk to Janice McNamara, TIE's International Development Trainer and Executive Coach, who is a huge part of the process to make this possible.

Immersion means experiencing the outside-in first-hand and viscerally. It involves direct exposure to situations and stimuli that build belief in both the possibility and feasibility of new and better ways to solve customer problems. Immersion entails getting out of your sector, or even of the world of business altogether to where you can find successful examples of things being done differently.

Janice talks to us about how she helps prepare people before these types of experiences. And how she unlocks people’s potential and channels the learnings.

She talks about the thousands of people she has prepared previously. And the important message she has communicated to make these experiences a success.

We talk about presenting to Princess Anne. How the experience almost went horribly wrong. But how it was saved in the end and the learnings from the experience.

She talks about what sparked her to get into this world. And how she can personally empathize with people being out of their comfort zone.

So much in this episode. I hope you enjoy it as much as I enjoyed creating it.

Find out more about Janice and get in touch with her, see her website here.

00:00:07:22 – 00:00:29:15
Philippa White
So the questions are these How can we really activate the best of the private sector to meet the challenges of the real world? Is there a way to accelerate my career that doesn’t involve boring online or classroom courses? And can I really impact people in the developing world with the skills that I have? Can I finally feel proud of what I know?

00:00:30:07 – 00:01:00:11
Philippa White
Those are the questions and this podcast will give you the answers. My name is Philippa White and this is TIE Unearthed. Keep listening and you can follow us on our journey as we show you how we’re connecting the private sector with the social sector to make change. Hello everyone. Phillip Whyte here and welcome to Episode 13 of Ties Podcast.

00:01:00:11 – 00:01:26:02
Philippa White
And today I’m really excited to be speaking with Janice McNamara. Now Janice is a specialist in leadership and teams. She’s a facilitator, coach, mentor, trainer and mediator. And she’s TIEs international development trainer and leadership or executive coach. Now today we will be talking about how changing perspectives can unearth your potential. So hello, Janice. It’s great to have you here with us.

00:01:26:02 – 00:01:29:23
Janice McNamara
I thank you. I’m really looking forward to having our conversation. Thanks, Philippa.

00:01:30:11 – 00:02:00:23
Philippa White
Me, too. Now, just to put this podcast into perspective for our listeners, I just wanted people to understand. So since about TIE, so since 2007, TIE has been connecting the private sector with the social sector to make change. And we’ve been doing this by linking professionals with social initiatives across the globe, creating a unique catalyst for flexing their leadership muscles in new ways, basically by stepping out of their comfort zones and working in completely unfamiliar environments, both culturally and socially.

00:02:01:08 – 00:02:24:08
Philippa White
We’re able to unleash the full potential of leaders through self-discovery and experiential learning and basically the result of being pushed out of their comfort zones. In this way, people learn how to better work in diverse situations, develop their cultural intelligence, their self-awareness, conscious leadership, and improved flexibility. Basically all skills that are needed to better lead into this world.

00:02:24:08 – 00:02:52:21
Philippa White
But basically they need to be prepared properly beforehand. And well, that’s where you come in. You’re a big part of this process to make it a success. You’re there to help prepare people for the experience through international development training, and you’re also there to help channel the learnings through the executive coaching. And today I just wanted to talk about how you for experiences like this, you’ve been doing it for a very long time, how you help them unlock their potential.

00:02:52:23 – 00:03:11:15
Philippa White
What tools and processes you use that perhaps even our listeners could perhaps use in their daily lives. So that basically brings me to my first question is perhaps you can tell us about what you do, why you do it. What was the journey for you to get to where you are today, the impact you’ve seen over to you?

00:03:12:00 – 00:03:35:22
Janice McNamara
Great. Thanks, Philippa. So I’ll touch on the what and the why first. So what I do is develop sort of bespoke support and practical solutions for leaders, teams and organizations. So I really try and help them address the challenges that relate to individual flexibility, resilience, creativity and the need to be positive and have strong relationships in the workplace.

00:03:36:02 – 00:03:57:24
Janice McNamara
And obviously, COVID is having a big impact on leaders and teams at the moment. So over the years, I’ve worked with a whole range of different organizations to sort of co-create solutions and to work with them to deliver that. And as you say, there’s a range of different approaches that I have, and I’ve been really, really fortunate, having worked for myself over such a long period of time.

00:03:57:24 – 00:04:25:17
Janice McNamara
Now, I’ve worked from I don’t know, from politicians, executives and across sectors, manufacturing, government departments, as well as working globally, whether that’s with the development sector like yourself or with global conservation. So I feel really privileged with the range of organizations I’ve worked with and I guess the reason why is I just love it. I’m in my flow and I can think of nothing else that I’d actually want to do more.

00:04:26:03 – 00:04:56:13
Janice McNamara
It’s amazing because I’m sat here in my lovely garden office in Manchester in the UK, and yet I can work with diverse organizations across the world. And when you asked me this question before this session, I was thinking about, Well, what is it that has really motivated me to do this? And actually, it was quite an interesting thing in terms of me reflecting upon this, because my real drive for it is really helping individuals to be at their best.

00:04:56:13 – 00:05:18:12
Janice McNamara
And that can sound a bit corny, but actually it’s really true because when I was and it’s hard to admit this, but actually when I was at school, it’s a strange thing to reveal, but I actually found reading and writing a real challenge, and the thought of going to the library could make me feel slightly sick at the thought of all the books, the words and the letters that you have to deal with.

00:05:18:24 – 00:05:47:06
Janice McNamara
And despite that challenge, I achieved my degree and post-graduate courses, and I’ve held senior leadership roles. But in it was only much, much later. And actually when I was 45, I had a dyslexia assessment. And the reason for that was that I was working with a senior leader who appeared really overwhelmed because she was having to deal with a lot of policy documents when she stepped into the job.

00:05:47:18 – 00:06:22:18
Janice McNamara
And I could really connect with how she was feeling. So I thought that I need to understand myself, to be able to help others. And so going through the assessment was really hard because I had to come to terms with understanding how deep an impact it had for me and the impact it had on my self-esteem. But when you ask about why, in a way that experience is now a really a bedrock for me, because I feel I can connect with the vulnerabilities that leaders and teams have.

00:06:23:01 – 00:06:34:24
Janice McNamara
And I really want to help those individuals build resilience and be the best they can be. So it’s really driven from a sort of personal passion and commitment that I have.

00:06:35:11 – 00:06:58:20
Philippa White
That’s amazing. Yeah. And I can imagine, you know, just being able to relate to, you know, you feeling vulnerable and various people from various different levels and backgrounds and roles. And obviously the, the types of, you know, through time, for example, people being completely out of their comfort zone through VR. So I guess you worked with VSO, didn’t you?

00:06:58:20 – 00:07:12:15
Philippa White
So having politicians being based in very foreign places and suddenly, you know, normally being in control and then feeling vulnerable, it must. Yeah, you must. And I can imagine being able to relate on how important that is.

00:07:13:00 – 00:07:30:09
Janice McNamara
And it’s incredible amount to the level of individuals, how often they’ll refer to imposter syndrome and how they’re not sure whether they should be in that place. And individuals in very, very senior roles feeling that. So it’s important for me to hold onto that empathy and to connect with that.

00:07:30:15 – 00:07:52:16
Philippa White
Yeah. Yeah. Really special to hear that. Now, we’ve been working together for a while now, almost ten years, and we’ve been through a lot, especially this year has been pretty full on. But tell me, I just love to know why did you start working with Ty? Just what’s that story? What’s what what inspired you, I guess, about what we do and.

00:07:53:07 – 00:08:21:21
Janice McNamara
Looks like on cue and is and continues to be a real pleasure to work with you. Philippa So yeah, it’s nice to have the opportunity to give that context really. And as you mentioned earlier on, my first career was in arts and culture and I had an incredible opportunity in my thirties to work in Namibia and I went on a two year contract but stayed for three years and supporting, of all things, museum development just seven years after independence from South Africa.

00:08:22:10 – 00:08:47:19
Janice McNamara
And to me museum is all about telling stories whose story, what story you going to tell and how are you going to tell it? So this was a massive practical and emotional challenge for me when this newly formed country that was still scarred by apartheid and the struggle for independence. It was an extraordinary time to be traveling alone and working with and bringing together different, diverse communities.

00:08:48:07 – 00:09:17:15
Janice McNamara
So then on my return to the UK, I became a lead trainer for VSO and at that time individuals were going on two year placements, so they were leaving their home, their family, and this is before mobile phones. You know, we really wanted to stepping out there and the professionals were hugely experienced from teachers, doctors, engineers, government officers, huge away going off to at that time, 74 different countries that we were working with.

00:09:18:20 – 00:09:48:24
Janice McNamara
And the training was one to ensure that they were committed for two years, that they weren’t going to get there and just come back again, but also to encourage them to develop that self awareness, to build the resilience, to adapt to that new country and culture and really, really importantly, to develop facilitation skills and to ensure that they weren’t going in with an arrogance that they were going to fix and save somebody else’s, going to bring in, and then but was about developing facilitation skills.

00:09:48:24 – 00:10:13:09
Janice McNamara
So they really co-created a solution and worked with people rather than doing to them because the history of development really shows how negative that approach can be. And I can’t quite believe that over the time that I worked with them, which was about 17 years, I’m told by then that was about 7000 volunteers that I worked with during that time, and that included politicians.

00:10:13:09 – 00:10:38:06
Janice McNamara
We had a whole program of politicians from from London, Scotland, south of Ireland, in addition to training, VSO, local and international staff, and bringing them together from all of those different countries was amazing. So when I was introduced to you, Philippa, I was really inspired about the TIE program and that I felt a real synergy with where I’d been and what I’d been doing with the work that you were developing.

00:10:38:24 – 00:11:05:09
Philippa White
Got well, it is just so reciprocated. I can’t tell you how honored to have you involved and involved for so long. And just listening to you talk about just to think that 1700 people, you managed to help them understand the importance of this messaging, which is, you know, don’t do two people work with them, just that is so important.

00:11:05:09 – 00:11:27:10
Philippa White
And you know, when I think about when I started, when I set up TIE and it just I never wanted it to be, you know, the North coming to save the south or this very sort of unbalanced sort of saviors coming over. And it’s always the whole goal has always been a win win. Very you know, you’re going to learn stuff.

00:11:27:10 – 00:11:46:03
Philippa White
We’re going to learn stuff, too. Let’s get roll our sleeves up, get stuck in and together, find solutions. And it’s going to be a, you know, a learning experience for everyone. And it’s just just listening to you say, I mean, I knew all of this and I love the fact that you you know, that phrase, don’t do two people, don’t do two people work with them.

00:11:46:03 – 00:12:17:05
Philippa White
It’s something that I hear as feedback from so many people who go on time. But just to think that, guys, you’ve been 1700 people is a lot of people, and that’s a huge impact of how to do things in a different way and how to approach development work in a different way. I think it’s so important and I yeah, I find I find I just I am so inspired by you every time I watch your training or hear, you know, quotes or the way that you respond to things, I just, oh, God, where people need this in their lives and you inspire so many people.

00:12:17:05 – 00:12:39:12
Philippa White
I mean, we obviously just finished one of our accelerator placements. And when I spoke to the team after they had done the development training, which is actually what we’re going to get into next, talking about and they they said, God, you know, why more people need to learn this. You know, I didn’t learn this in school. I didn’t learn this in university where people supposed to get this information like.

00:12:40:15 – 00:13:09:20
Janice McNamara
I, I think one of the things that I thank you for that, I think one of the things that really as well during that time and to continue as a lead VSO trainee, you had to keep topping up your international experience. So during that time, I was fortunate to to deliver the training in other recruitment bases for them, which was in the Netherlands and Canada, but also with sure short term placements in the China office and the Pakistan office.

00:13:10:02 – 00:13:16:13
Janice McNamara
So that was great because that really refreshing me and challenging me in how I approach things.

00:13:16:22 – 00:13:36:04
Philippa White
Yeah, I mean I want to talk about the development training just because as I say, I, I love it. And obviously Evelyn, who maybe is going to be listening to this so big shout out to Evelyn because she was, you know, the first person that kind of got this going. And then and then obviously you you are now doing it as well.

00:13:36:22 – 00:14:06:23
Philippa White
But but, you know, this program that was developed, you know, the purpose obviously is to help prepare people for their experience by helping them to step out of the private sector and into international development. So by getting them learning things they never learned before about the world, seeing things from a completely different perspective, learning about development, you know, the timeline of development, why development exists, power the players in development.

00:14:06:23 – 00:14:44:01
Philippa White
Colonia, colonia like colonialization, you know, what does that look like today? And you know, and so much more. And you obviously run this training for us and have done, as I say, for almost ten years now. And the goal is to provide people with the tools, like you’ve said, to thrive in a completely unknown and different world. And I just I’d love you to just, I don’t know, talk about what you do to help prepare people for experiences like this, both with Tai, but obviously what you did with VSO, for example, but also what, you know, why this type of learning and transition is so important.

00:14:44:01 – 00:14:59:19
Philippa White
And I don’t know, perhaps you can share some of the tools you use that people can use if they’re about to embark on something similar. Maybe some of the quote unquote is such a lovely one. And just yeah, if you could just bring to life this because I get inspired every time I hear, okay.

00:15:00:01 – 00:15:22:20
Janice McNamara
So first of all, I want to talk a little bit about leadership really, because to me, leadership development starts with yourself and understanding yourself and knowing your strengths and weaknesses and having a self-perception about the skills that you need to engage and motivate, motivate others. And I think this is really not easy to do. And the leadership program has a real focus.

00:15:23:02 – 00:16:01:18
Janice McNamara
Some leadership programs have a focus on sort of management theory models, which are great, but the case studies are maybe theoretical and more. And without that really practical experience. And the thing that I think is quite in terms of the TIE training and the whole TIE experience is that there’s an opportunity for transformational change where an individual can really discover and build on their own set of skills and capabilities and really building qualities around self reflection and also building that self-confidence and resilience.

00:16:02:07 – 00:16:37:04
Janice McNamara
So the learning needs to be really relevant and meaningful. And so that we can really be an effective leader and to be continually open and evolving. So I think what’s great about the TIE experience is the fact that the organization is a completely new organization to you and then a very different or different part of the world. So that involves a real challenge and now working with the program virtually, I still feel it’s hugely experiential and really engaging with that organization.

00:16:37:04 – 00:17:05:04
Janice McNamara
So sort of proven that through that experience, it’s that the learning is much more powerful and it helps individuals really change and change in a way that’s sustainable rather than just slipping back into old habits, really. And I think part timers around the diversity of the organization sense as well. Phillippa And how as a a leader we have to adapt to that because it’s not only what we do.

00:17:05:04 – 00:17:36:04
Janice McNamara
You know, quite often as leaders we’re thinking about what’s the vision, what’s the strategy, how are we going to put this into place? But I think the thing about time is really considering about how how we work and how we work with that organization. Unlike, say, stepping from the private sector into social enterprise is one cultural step. And where there’s a huge change there, looking at the fact that you’re working with a different country, a different culture, language, all of those really bring that rich diversity.

00:17:36:04 – 00:18:11:19
Janice McNamara
And so the aim of the training is also to deepen the individual’s understanding of that international development world and the processes that have an impact on how people, nations and individuals really evolve and the impact on the organization that you’re working with. So we give some historical context and also we introduce aspects around cultural awareness. And as you were saying, the quote around, you know, we see the world as how we are rather than how the reality of it really, because we have we have filters and those filters are there because of our own experience.

00:18:12:00 – 00:18:25:14
Janice McNamara
That can be a positive thing. And we bring our experience to things. But actually it’s really opening our eyes in a new way. And I’d like to give some examples from an experience that we simply had, if that’s all right.

00:18:25:14 – 00:18:28:23
Philippa White
Philippa Yeah, please, please, please. I love.

00:18:28:24 – 00:18:59:05
Janice McNamara
It. So for me, I’ve, I’ve had an experience and I was so fortunate just before COVID and lockdown, I took part as a delegate in what was actually, sadly, the final years program for CSC leaders, which was established by Prince Philip over 50 years ago. And that’s a leadership program for senior leaders across across the world and they are invited to take part in the program.

00:18:59:12 – 00:19:41:10
Janice McNamara
And there was actually 70 of us taking part, as I say, before lockdown. And we had the amazing opportunity of visiting social enterprises and private companies who had community initiatives in London, Manchester and Delhi. So it was great for me because it was a few years since I’ve done international work myself. So I as as a group of individuals who have senior leadership experience, we were invited to visit these different organizations and then put together proposals that were going to be put forward that the successful package, if you like, was going to be put forward to the Commonwealth Heads of Government meeting coming up actually this year.

00:19:42:06 – 00:20:12:12
Janice McNamara
And there was a huge challenge because they broke us into groups of 70 people and I was in a group of about 12 individuals and we had a finite, very short amount of time to co-create an initiative and to present that to a professional panel which included Princess Anne. So it was an interesting opportunity, but the pretty pressure and within the heat was on because within my team, so having the team there was someone from Mexico, India, Bangladesh.

00:20:12:12 – 00:20:39:05
Janice McNamara
I was trying to remember all these Pakistan, Portugal, Egypt, Australia and Nigeria. So that was the group of us pulled together with the range of not only are countries in cultural context, but all personalities, leadership styles, professional expertize and perspective. It was hugely diverse and so we were under this pressure and initially there was a huge amount of enthusiasm.

00:20:39:15 – 00:21:19:19
Janice McNamara
But it was interesting. During the afternoon that we were working, I could start to see that that enthusiasm started to dissipate as understandably sort of extrovert. More heroic leaders were taking the frame and quite rightly were sort of trying to help move us forward. But as a consequence, we were not maximizing on the diversity and knowledge within the group and different viewpoints as individuals started to step back and it was clear at the end of that day, despite the fact that we were going to deliver this presentation by noon the next day, that we were going in a circle, we weren’t getting very far and that night fell apart.

00:21:19:19 – 00:21:46:22
Janice McNamara
I did not sleep. I tossed and hat and felt really uncomfortable because I knew that everyone in that group were desperate to be at their best, to really shine, and to really be able to be heard and contribute. So it was interesting. All of the things that we’ve covered in the Time program became very real for me. I was at the time I woke up in the morning, which well, I didn’t wake up.

00:21:46:22 – 00:21:49:04
Janice McNamara
I got out of my bed at 5:00.

00:21:49:05 – 00:21:50:16
Philippa White
I just got out of bed.

00:21:51:05 – 00:22:11:08
Janice McNamara
Well, yeah, I’ve been tossed into it. So some of the things I started to think about, well, well, as a as a leader within my role within this group, I felt I’d actually been quite passive and observed what had gone on the day before. And I thought, it’s time for me now to really draw on these facilitation skills that I talk about so much and I need to use them.

00:22:11:14 – 00:22:33:01
Janice McNamara
And I was incredibly nervous about it, but I, I did some prep in terms of just preparing some blank schedules that we actually had something to look at, organizing the space that we were in and looking back at the protocols that the conference that actually put tours at the start. So when everyone joined the group, I asked the permission.

00:22:33:02 – 00:22:56:21
Janice McNamara
I just said, I don’t know how you’re all feeling, but this is how I’m feeling at the moment. And I want us all to shine. And by trade, I’m a facilitator and I would love to support you with this and almost a sigh of relief within the room. So when you think about takeaways, some of the things within that group was around looking back to the agreement of how are we going to work together?

00:22:56:21 – 00:23:23:23
Janice McNamara
Let’s just talk about how we worked yesterday and let’s listen to understand because people had so many ideas that were just laying them on top of each other. So this thing of listening to understand was really key in terms of scheduling the time. Both the prep and the delivery, and then identify the skills and expertize that we had within the group and acknowledging those range of expertize but also styles that someone visionary, someone analytical, some have that skills.

00:23:23:23 – 00:23:45:01
Janice McNamara
Yeah. So we had to do that incredibly quickly, but to really acknowledge that within the group. So we divided into sub teams, all of the teams were expected to present and so we supported individuals who may be not so confident to present in such a forum and create a checklist in terms of timing, how we were going to move forward with this.

00:23:45:15 – 00:24:10:05
Janice McNamara
And recently so so we presented and actually I sat in the audience and sort of was there was like a motivator in the crowd, if you like. And we were pleased and the group were really pleased in how they presented. And it was only recently when I was actually updating my LinkedIn profile and I was looking for things out connected to that.

00:24:10:05 – 00:24:42:22
Janice McNamara
And I came across a video by Officer Nicholson, who was actually one of the people in the group, and she’s a C D for the Palladium and Palladium organization in Nigeria. And she had put forward this video describing how she was in the group and describing from her perspective how it worked and I was hugely appreciative of that because she described how someone stepped up and actually demonstrated a term that’s now it’s interesting being talked of more often, the servant leader.

00:24:42:22 – 00:25:02:23
Janice McNamara
So I wasn’t I wasn’t thinking of that at the time, but how how could I help others step up and be the best they could be? But actually, in the moment you didn’t see me. I didn’t present. I wasn’t there. And that wasn’t the issue for me. My issue was that I wanted them to stand up and be the best they could be.

00:25:03:06 – 00:25:26:03
Janice McNamara
So it was lovely to get her acknowledgment that actually you can’t see me, but I played that role in really supporting that. So it was a huge challenge. Philippa And honestly, I felt incredibly nervous about it, but it was really good for me to have that challenge because in a way it’s all very well to enable others in terms of training and delivery.

00:25:26:10 – 00:25:30:24
Janice McNamara
But you need to come back and again challenge yourself and be put in that vulnerable place.

00:25:31:15 – 00:25:32:05
Philippa White
Thirdly.

00:25:33:18 – 00:25:34:09
Janice McNamara
You. Yeah.

00:25:34:11 – 00:26:05:19
Philippa White
And just listening. Yeah. And listening to you talk. It just makes me think of our coaching, which you also, you know, you, you are a, you know, your executive coach as well. And well, we think, you know, why do we need to have that? It’s just listening to you talk about the experience of of working with that diverse group of people in that situation, what happened as a result, and then actually how you have then channeled that into your work.

00:26:05:19 – 00:26:22:01
Philippa White
You know, what were those learnings? Okay, God, I really shone here. I really this is an area that I you know, I really actually enjoy it. I mean, you’ve been doing it forever. But the thing is, is you got to not only use the skills that you have, but also channel that experience and you still reflect on it, as you say, like now.

00:26:22:01 – 00:26:49:08
Philippa White
And I think that’s also a big part of what Ty’s all about. You know, you have that experience there. Immerse yourself in a completely different environment. You unlock the your strengths, your weaknesses, what makes you tick, what gets you excited. But then the trick is, okay, what do you do with that? And, you know, and it’s showing what people, you know, the power of seeing things in a different way, showing them then how, you know, changing perspectives can impact your work.

00:26:49:14 – 00:27:08:13
Philippa White
And then you know how to then channel that in into your work. And I guess what Ty’s all about is, is inspiring participants to then use that drive and energy and new vision to make change and be a change maker at their company or a company that they might want to work out or in the world in general.

00:27:09:11 – 00:27:41:03
Philippa White
And yeah. And in order to channel that energy before and after TIE coaching is a big part of that process. And as I say, you’ve also been a coach for TIE for a good number of years as well. We didn’t start originally with coaching, but then very quickly we realized the importance of it. And and I just wonder if maybe touching on this, you know, over the years you’ve had a number of conversations around change and leadership and and I just wonder what knowledge and insights I don’t know, you can pass on to our listeners, especially now in a post-COVID world.

00:27:41:03 – 00:28:06:22
Janice McNamara
I think that the coaching is really and it was interesting, I myself didn’t come to coaching for a long time. I was a facilitator and I get a lot of that feedback from the larger group. But actually when I came to coaching and actually witness in that 1 to 1 situation, how through individuals really reflecting on the impact for them is really, really profound.

00:28:07:05 – 00:28:37:11
Janice McNamara
And COVID emphasized that to me even more. The first thing I did when COVID struck was I was working on two different leadership programs and immediately contacted the range of individuals I was working with. Really to get a sense of how they were managing that change. And it’s interesting, I’m part of a network across Europe of coaches, and we check in with each other every two or three weeks as a whole, a really, really large group.

00:28:37:19 – 00:29:07:17
Janice McNamara
And it’s interesting, we’ve been talking about the fact that individuals feel victim at the moment. They can feel a victim of the situation. And through that, we blame the government or blame others. And because we feel insecure and it’s fascinating actually that the coaching to really help individuals come to terms with that because if we’re going to lead and support others, we have to invest in ourselves and really ensure that we look out for ourselves.

00:29:07:17 – 00:29:28:23
Janice McNamara
So that day by day we’re thinking, okay, how are we going to manage today? How will my staying physically and mentally well? So it’s all very much part of that self insight and and building your own resilience so you can build the resilience in others. So I think coach coaching is even more significant, profound now than it’s ever been because of COVID.

00:29:29:15 – 00:29:54:22
Philippa White
Yeah. And I mean, I just think from the point of view of the coaching for Ty, which is helping people prepare for the, you know, this experience. And so kind of like you say, preparing yourself, reflecting on what’s important to you, where your strengths lie, what you hope to get out of it, the experience, how you hope to shine, how you hope to bring these experiences back into your work.

00:29:55:05 – 00:30:18:11
Philippa White
But then the second coaching on the back end is also, I think, so important because it’s about what what did happen. How have you changed what, what, what, how have you found your purpose? I mean, this is what I just find. So it’s it’s such an incredible process of really just unlock in people’s just understanding, like you say, of themselves, but then their potential and then how.

00:30:18:11 – 00:30:29:01
Philippa White
Okay, so what what do you think you can do with this? What you know, what is your purpose? What did you discover about yourselves and just yeah. Just how you managed to do that on, on these.

00:30:29:07 – 00:31:12:18
Janice McNamara
And I think that is so significant because of this thing of really being authentic to yourself and connecting with your own values so that conscious leadership are really being you when you’re doing that. And I, I love this aspect around the interpret the ship where you return into your workplace. But actually what difference do you make within your own organization and how those new insights both about yourself and about the global context you can really enrich your day to day practice and also influence those around you and the space to reflect on a personal level really adds value to it.

00:31:12:24 – 00:31:41:07
Philippa White
Yeah. Oh, gosh, no. Listen, we’re coming to the end of the podcast, but I did just want to ask you tell me, I mean, you’re so busy whenever I talk to you, you’ve got, you know, you know, talking to the Isle of Wight and it’s oh, energy. So green energy windfarm windfarm company. And then you’re talking to another you’re just talking to so such a huge range of different people and companies and leaders.

00:31:41:07 – 00:31:51:13
Philippa White
And you’re just an incredibly interesting and interested person, just keen to know what you’re working on at the moment. Is there anything that I haven’t asked you that I don’t know you’d like to tell our listeners.

00:31:52:07 – 00:32:20:17
Janice McNamara
Just to give you a flavor of the things that I’m working on moments this week, I’ve been facilitating workshops for a global global conservation organization who support leaders in different conservation organizations and who influence the delivery of that work. Building leadership on the ground for conservation, which has been great. And then next week I’ve got work with leaders across what we call the Northern Powerhouse.

00:32:20:23 – 00:32:42:03
Janice McNamara
So the northern part of the UK working with different leaders there. So I just feel so privileged honestly in my lovely room that I’ve got here and my God and I feel like I’m in a what is it? When we filled up a camper van, I feel I’m in this camper van traveling around the world, but actually I’m stuck in the garden with no wheels on it.

00:32:43:09 – 00:32:43:21
Philippa White
Because.

00:32:43:21 – 00:33:05:01
Janice McNamara
You know the screen and then I’m speaking to you in Brazil and then somebody else in another part of the world or another part of the UK. So I feel just so privileged and I’ve got that sort of fizzy feeling and, and I hope to do that where I’m continually learning and challenging myself as well really. So yeah, it’s a such, such a privilege.

00:33:05:11 – 00:33:43:20
Philippa White
Oh well, you know, I love working with you. I’m so excited. We’re we’re kicking off a new project. Are we on? Yeah. On Monday you’re going to be kicking off our next tie advisor initiative with Paul. And to me, working with Parul to executive their coaches and executive search founders of their own companies. And they’re going to be helping Parul in India, the executive director and founder of an organization that works with children’s rights in, you know, working with slum children and tribal children and just stopping child labor.

00:33:43:20 – 00:33:57:07
Philippa White
And anyway, Parul is amazing in having these three powerhouses. So Parul in India and then these two individuals based in the UK, it’s going to be exciting. So yes, you’ve got your training and coaching that’s going to be kicking off. It’s going to be a busy day.

00:33:57:07 – 00:34:02:24
Janice McNamara
I’m really, really looking forward to it. Yeah, they all sound very, very into the question, which is great.

00:34:03:16 – 00:34:22:15
Philippa White
Yeah, good. Well, listen, Janice, thank you for your time. It’s always I adore our conversations, which happen quite regularly at the moment. So thank you for everything that you do and for your passion and for your love of what you do. And just honestly, being such an important member of our team, we couldn’t do what we do without you.

00:34:22:15 – 00:34:23:16
Philippa White
So thank you for every.

00:34:23:16 – 00:34:26:00
Janice McNamara
Thank you. Thanks for your inspiration, Philippa.

00:34:26:15 – 00:34:31:08
Philippa White
Take care and have a lovely rest. Thank you. Bye.

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